10 replies to this topic

[rungroot]

Hey guys, a sheikh was making a khutbah in our local Masjid about Hazrat Yunus A. S.  with regards to how his people were close to an annihilating azab from Allah SWT but Allah never sent the deadly azab because their Prophet Hazrat Yunus A.S. had left them in anger (because of the people's disobedience to Allah) BEFORE Allah gave him permission to.  Now that kinda clicked in my mind as far as the people of Pakistan are concerned.  Now prophethood has ended with Rasool Allah S.A.W. but Allah's law still applies BUT now from the perspective of a true Islamic AMEER!  I got around to thinking, ever since the assassination of Liaqat Ali Khan, the nation has really NOT had a decent Ameer who would govern in accordance to Allah's law.   Now, one can make an argument that ulema are there BUT there is one big problem there.  You see, a Holy Prophet of Allah is not only a nabi, a rasool and a scholar for his people, HE IS ALSO AN AMEER, the head of his people, his tribe or his nation.  His people HAVE to follow him willingly or else face annihilation at the hands of Allah.   Now, no doubt that we in Pakistan have A TON of ulema, both good and bad.  But the problem is that the good ulema don't step up and offer themselves as an ameer while the bad ulema are far too sectarian and/or politicized to prove to be good ameers worthy of being considered as the ones who would govern by the Quran and the sunnah.  Case in point, please consider the example of Dr. Israr Ahmed (may Allah grant him peace) and his son Hafiz Akif Saeed; both were and are good ulema but they have always always ALWAYS refrained from stepping up offering themselves as an Ameer at the national level.  Heck, THEY REFUSE to do so because of the immense responsibilities it carries.  The result?  Only crap mullahs like maulvi diesel or the liberal democratic garbage came in and filled the void that was left behind because good  people like Dr. Israr Ahmed never stepped up.   And they PROUDLY say that we never demanded to be made the ameer ul momineen in Pakistan.  I say SHAME on them, they left the ground open for filth to come in and fill the void because of there refusal.  Having said that, could it be that SINCE we have not had a good ameer in almost 70 years, Allah has only been sending minor to medium azab on us but has NOT sent the ultimate annihilating azab purely out of his mercy?

Could this be true?   Let's discuss this in the light of the Quran and the sunnah AND LEAVE DEMOCRAZY OUT of this.  Should we start a movement to look for a true ameer for all to gather around and follow his lead?  Or am I misinterpreting and my mind is just wandering off somewhere in lala land???

[Truth Never Dies]

Asalam-o-alikum,

Nice Post dear, and nice to know that we started to found the solution of life , in the real and true stories of our Messengers AS, sent by Allah on time to time , for our Guidance.

After reading the Holy Quran, its clear that Allah not need our Prayers, he just need the Prayers without Association like in , In Surah Younus 10 Ayah 18 " They worship besides Allah that which neither hurteth them nor profiteth them, and they say: These are our intercessors with Allah. Say: Would ye inform Allah of (something) that He knoweth not in the heavens or in the earth? Praised be He and high exalted above all that ye associate (with Him)"

and in another Place Allah said "And verily, if thou shouldst ask them: Who created the heavens and the earth? they will say: Allah. Say: Bethink you then of those ye worship beside Allah, if Allah willed some hurt for me, could they remove from me His hurt; or if He willed some mercy for me, could they restrain His mercy? Say: Allah is my all. In Him do (all) the trusting put their trust." Surah Zumar 39, Ayah 38.

So Allah in both two ayah clearly stated those who commit shirk , also accept Allah as the Key, but they associate with Allah. In another Place Allah Stated that "And (remember) when Luqman said unto his son, when he was exhorting him: O my dear son! Ascribe no partners unto Allah. Lo! to ascribe partners (unto Him) is a tremendous wrong - Surah Luqman 31, Ayah 21.

So when we start to read the quran with meanings, then we noticed, that Allah just need our prayers without association of any other, and when the shirk in the nation started to increase, Allah Azab arrived, daily in our Namaz (salah) we said "Thee (alone) we worship; Thee (alone) we ask for help." Surah Fatiha 1 Ayah 4.

So when we start thinking that Every thing is our Allah, and all are his slaves, then the problems also started to solve.

Allah describe him as "Allah is the Light of the heavens and the earth. The similitude of His light is as a niche wherein is a lamp. The lamp is in a glass. The glass is as it were a shining star. (This lamp is) kindled from a blessed tree, an olive neither of the East nor of the West, whose oil would almost glow forth (of itself) though no fire touched it. Light upon light. Allah guideth unto His light whom He will. And Allah setteth forth for mankind similitudes, for Allah is Knower of all things. " Surah Noor 24, Ayah 35.


Truth Never Dies!

[rungroot]

Brother TND,

You are right but did you notice the underlying tone in all the verses you mentioned?  Each and every nation that Allah scolds in those verses HAD AN AMEER THAT Allah HAD SENT FOR THOSE PEOPLE TO FOLLOW.  Now all those ameers were also prophets.  We can't have prophets today, who so ever claims to be one is a kafir BUT WE CAN AND SHOULD HAVE AN AMEER THAT WOULD RULE IN ACCORDANCE TO THE QURAN AND THE SUNNAH.  Now, no doubt that our people are committing shirk by talking part in the filth of democracy.  But maybe, JUST MAYBE, Allah may or is having mercy on us because we have not had a true Islamic ameer yet.  Allah by slim.  If this is the case then we as a nation better switch to high gear in looking for such an ameer and give him the power WITHOUT any votes or democracy.  

The next natural question that arises is what characteristics should such an ameer have and why should he be given power?  I believe the answer lies in Surah Yusouf.

[GreenBeret]

In Islamic religion,there is a prophecy of india or indo-pak being liberated with armies of Mehdi(R.A) after conquer of syria by Imam Mehdi's armies.

the liberation can be: liberation of Pakistan from cruel rulers or liberation of india from its hindu rulers for muslims.

whereas the rulers will be chained and brought to Syria to Hazrat Imam Mehdi (R.A).

About the khilafat that u have mentioned, in the prophecies,in future, it will be started after death of Hazrat Issa (A.S).

[GreenBeret]

Truth Never Dies!

Pakistan is mired by many problems apart from shirk. and if the point is coming towards Allah and leaving sins forever, then we are facing an uphill task of changing a corrupt system in which lies, deceit, murder, injustice, bribes, abuse of power etc and much more needs to be addressed and basically fear of Allah, rather than shirk.

[Skull-Buster]

GreenBeret, on 10 July 2012 - 04:50 AM, said:

Truth Never Dies!

Pakistan is mired by many problems apart from shirk. and if the point is coming towards Allah and leaving sins forever, then we are facing an uphill task of changing a corrupt system in which lies, deceit, murder, injustice, bribes, abuse of power etc and much more needs to be addressed and basically fear of Allah, rather than shirk.

Why should we stop addressing Shirk? Do you know that all the other ills in the Pakistani society you mentioned are things which Allah can forgive, but Shirk is the only sin which Allah will not forgive. Its strange that a person says let us forget about Shirk despite that.

[GreenBeret]

Skull-Buster, on 10 July 2012 - 04:59 AM, said:

Why should we stop addressing Shirk? Do you know that all the other ills in the Pakistani society you mentioned are things which Allah can forgive, but Shirk is the only sin which Allah will not forgive. Its strange that a person says let us forget about Shirk despite that.

no where does in my post it mentioned to "forget shirk" ---- stop being single minded.

TND just mentioned and concentrated on one problem, where-as i mentioned many other problems and fear of Allah is supposed to be the right way to address the problem as 90-95% are muslims in the country already

[salaudin]

To the extent I understood Islam, Shirk is surely an unforgivable sin BUT it is a sin for which an individual is ONLY answerable to Allah. People tend to limit Islam to individual habits and prayers yet majority of the prescriptions in Islam are geared towards how one should behave in a society as a Muslim.

We tend to pay more attention on how to "appear" Muslim rather than "behaving" like a Muslim. E.g. have a beard, go to mosques etc while doing all this, bribe, cheat, lie, rob etc. Our social degradation has more to do with not "behaving" like a Muslim, and little to do with "appearing" like a Muslim.

[Truth Never Dies]

rungroot, on 10 July 2012 - 02:37 AM, said:

Brother TND,

You are right but did you notice the underlying tone in all the verses you mentioned?  Each and every nation that Allah scolds in those verses HAD AN AMEER THAT Allah HAD SENT FOR THOSE PEOPLE TO FOLLOW.  Now all those ameers were also prophets.  We can't have prophets today, who so ever claims to be one is a kafir BUT WE CAN AND SHOULD HAVE AN AMEER THAT WOULD RULE IN ACCORDANCE TO THE QURAN AND THE SUNNAH.  Now, no doubt that our people are committing shirk by talking part in the filth of democracy.  But maybe, JUST MAYBE, Allah may or is having mercy on us because we have not had a true Islamic ameer yet.  Allah by slim.  If this is the case then we as a nation better switch to high gear in looking for such an ameer and give him the power WITHOUT any votes or democracy.  

The next natural question that arises is what characteristics should such an ameer have and why should he be given power?  I believe the answer lies in Surah Yusouf.

Brother.

Look What Allah saying in Surah Nisa 4, Ayah 59 "O you who believe, obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority among you. Then, if you quarrel about something, revert it back to Allah and the Messenger, ³⁰ if you believe in Allah and the Last Day. That is good, and the best at the end. (59)"

So we need to follow the Allah and Messanger SAWW, and those who are with authority, but when they give us the order which against the order of Allah and sunnah of Messenger SAWW, then we have to return to the Original order.

So we not need ameer, we need the Teacher, who guide us towards True Islam, Brothers.  

Surah Al Imran 3, Ayah 173  " That is) those to whom people said, “The people have gathered against you; so, fear them.” It increased them in Faith and they said, “Allah is fully sufficient for us, and the best One in whom to trust.”

I hope i answered your question. and please dont divide yourselves in the Groups, look what Allah said in Surah Al Inam 6, Ayah 159 "Surely, those who have made divisions in their religion and turned into factions, you have nothing to do with them. Their case rests with Allah alone; then He will tell them what they have been doing."

and in another verse Allah Said  Surah al Imran 3, Ayah 105 "Do not be like those who became divided and fell into disputes after the clear signs had come to them. Those are the ones for whom there is a grave punishment "

Truth Never Dies!

[Truth Never Dies]

GreenBeret, on 10 July 2012 - 04:50 AM, said:

Truth Never Dies!

Pakistan is mired by many problems apart from shirk. and if the point is coming towards Allah and leaving sins forever, then we are facing an uphill task of changing a corrupt system in which lies, deceit, murder, injustice, bribes, abuse of power etc and much more needs to be addressed and basically fear of Allah, rather than shirk.

Brother,

All these things in which we are facing problems, all are because ,we not afraid of Allah, we afraid of super powers, we not want to follow Islam , we wanted to follow the Politicians, we not want to act on the sunnah of Prophet SAWW, we wanted to act on the instructions of our so called bosses.

we all are divided into factions, and the only solution for all those problems, are , to return to Allah and return to the Original faith, and the most modern art of living  is Islam and Islam only.

Surah al Imran 3, Ayah 83 "Are they, then, seeking a religion other than that of Allah, while to Him alone submit all those in the heavens and the earth, willingly or unwilling, and to Him they shall be returned?"

Truth Never Dies!

[Jazba-e-Kashmir]

very interesting thread brother Rungoot.

Great post by the other users with a lot of philosophy and theory focused on the practical groundrealities in Pakistan.



I have my point of view which is; Hazrat Ibrahim (May Allah Bless his soul) was an anti-trendsetter/anti-trendy in that sense when the people of Mecca became idol-worshippers, he went the other way. He did not worship manmade idols. He was mocked and laughed because he was different in his way of thinking.
Just like when Prophet Muhammad (SAWS) did and went through the same procedure when he announced his Lovely Blessed Prophethood (SAWS).

The comparative relation this has regarded Pakistan is, Pakistanis are trendy, do what other Pakistanis do, copy everything from the western culture and call it modern, Pakistanis compete with materialistic things, objects and issues.
E.g. cars, houses/villas/bangla, money, status this and status that.

Because:
No one is a Pakistani untill a plot or a house is owned by an individial in any defence area in Pakistan.
No one is a Pakistani untill a expensive western made car is parked in your garage/car porch.
No one is a Pakistani untill an individual goes to expensive shopping centres to buy expensive trendy brand clothes or perfumes.
No one is a Pakistani untill a person watches bollywood movies, songs, actors, actress, models etc..
No one is a Pakistani untill a person knows the names of each and single actors, actress, models, movies and songs.
No one is a Pakistani untill a person has so much money in the bank that people would want to be slaves of the rich individuals.


BUT


If a normal average humble Pakistani is satisfied for what he or she has, a small simple house, a cheap nothing-special-car or a horse, or a small sized 50cc/125cc motorbike that can transport from A to B, has a normal stable income and does not copy from the western culture/society but tries to develop from the very own local society area along with the people to achieve great levels for their own future generations, then everything is total laughable, backwarded and primitive.

Such people are not part of the society, they are not part of the trend and are treated as outcasts from the socalled trendy superficial status, superficial reputation, superficial respect and superficial life living people.
Such people don't want to discuss facts but want to feel right about everything thing, every discussion and word without acknowledging selfcritically they are wrong and don't have enough educated informed wisdom to discuss facts.

This is called ignorance and what Quran also says: Deaf, dumb and blind; and they return not. (Quran: Surah Baqarah - Verse 18 - Translation: Pickthal)

When majority of people live in ignorance, lack of education, health benefits and a great prospect future, the rich elite who can change the poor peoples lives and mislead the misguided masses - don't do anything about the state of the people; then they are no better and are equally ignorants, backwarded and primitive from all angles.

Many Companions of the Prophet Muhammad (SAWS) were so wealthy and rich, that they bought slaves to set them free, like the Beautiful Black Bilal (may Allah Bless his soul).

Or as Usman Ibn Affan did when he bought a well for 30.000 Dirhams who made it a public property because the non-Muslim owners of the well demanded heavy water taxes from the Muslims.**

In other words, if God has Blessed a Muslim with lot of money, then that person has great responsibilities to use them correctly. As that would be among the questions from Allah on The Jugdement Day, where did a person earn money from, where did a person use them and for which reasons.


Peace


** (Note: Hundred Great Muslims, pp. 34-35. Author: Kh. Jamil Ahmed, published in 1969)