12 replies to this topic

[waz]

Well it has been talked about for years. I remember Mushy during his stint stating that the navy had a nuclear propulsion design and  that the navy was to proceed with a sub, now it is indeed the case. This will ensure our second strike capability and give us the option to attack hostiles further afar.


Indian shore mid of this month . Pakistan Navy chief has already told US Defence Magazine that arrival of Russian Nuclear  powered submarine and engine power generation with a nuclear power plant.
Pakistan also has the expertise of submarine technologies were transferred including design and development skills and tools. Building of hulls and experience with Western subsystems, many of which are used in the French nuclear submarines would help the Pakistani SSN / SSBN.
Pakistan with expertise and transfers of technology from China , will be able to field their first nuclear submarine in next 5 to 8 years and brand it “Indigenous “. But experts have difference of opinion on usage of this submarine in both forces  , While Nuclear Submarine in Indian navy will complete Nuclear 2nd strike option for India , but Pakistani nuclear submarine might be built to attack prized Indian Aircraft carriers in case of conflict .  India who will have 3 or more fleet of aircraft carriers in near future will always be Pakistani navies prime target , even in 1971  Indo-Pak war , Indian aircraft carrier was always a prize target for them .

http://idrw.org/?p=8896

[waz]

ISLAMABAD — Media reports on Feb. 11 state the Pakistan Navy intends to build nuclear-powered submarines as a matter of priority.
No sources were quoted in the reports, which indicated the first submarine would be operational in five to eight years.
When contacted by Defense News, a spokesman for the Pakistani Navy said he could not comment as to the veracity of the reports.
Mansoor Ahmed, a lecturer at Islamabad’s Quaid-e-Azam University who specializes in nonconventional weapons and missiles, believes the reports are the result of a calculated leak by the Navy, and that a message may be being sent to India.
“This news … appears to be some kind of signaling to the Indians seeing as they are taking delivery of a new nuclear-powered submarine from the Russians as well as their own Arihant Class SSBN,” he said.
“So Pakistan is signaling to the Indians that they are mindful of these developments and taking due measures in response.”
Ahmed said he has for some time believed Pakistan was working on a nuclear propulsion system for submarine applications and that Pakistan already has a functional submarine launched variant of the Babur cruise missile.
The Babur cruise missile is very similar to the U.S. BGM-109 Tomahawk, and perhaps derives at least some technology from Tomahawks which crashed in Pakistan during U.S. strikes on al-Qaida training camps in Afghanistan in 1998. It can be armed with conventional or nuclear warheads.
Ahmed believes Pakistan is now gearing up to build its own SSN/SSGN flotilla as a way of deterring India and maintaining the strategic balance in South Asia.
However, in the long term in order to fully ensure the credibility of its deterrent Ahmed said he believes Pakistan should build ballistic missile submarines.
http://www.defensene...well|text|World

[ISI2003]

probably going to be a late model 091 han class (hopefully not, because those boats are very noisy ... aka sitting ducks) and hopefully it will be early gen 093 Chinese SSN on a lease / copy

2-3 SSN With Launch tubes for stealthy cruise missiles would allow for Attack roles with secondary second strike roles (probably could lease type 093 from 2020-2025, till Pakistan can copy it or buy the subs and call them indigenous, it doesn't really matter, as having even two to three of these boats will be a major major deterent)

BTW here are the type 093 boats
http://www.jeffhead....-Type093-02.jpg

http://www.sinodefen...ype093shang.asp

http://1.bp.blogspot...ine %281%29.jpg

[nidakhan]

good news for Pakistan navy

[waz]

 ISI2003, on 07 March 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

probably going to be a late model 091 han class (hopefully not, because those boats are very noisy ... aka sitting ducks) and hopefully it will be early gen 093 Chinese SSN on a lease / copy

2-3 SSN With Launch tubes for stealthy cruise missiles would allow for Attack roles with secondary second strike roles (probably could lease type 093 from 2020-2025, till Pakistan can copy it or buy the subs and call them indigenous, it doesn't really matter, as having even two to three of these boats will be a major major deterent)

BTW here are the type 093 boats
http://www.jeffhead....-Type093-02.jpg

http://www.sinodefen...ype093shang.asp

http://1.bp.blogspot...%25281%2529.jpg

I don't think it will be an existing model due to safety and issues of obsoleteness and will be built something along the lines of a type 095 or smaller version of the type 096. It will launch ballistic missiles as our experience with ballistic missile is far more extensive and their ranges far outdo the current range of our cruise missiles. Ballistic missiles also gives us a far greater range of strike options.

[ISI2003]

with Pakistan's economic outlook, Pakistan has to take what it can get from china
if china gives 3 type 093s; then Pakistan will make due

look at the current 6 qing class boats, basically free, Pakistan  is broke, we have no choice until the economy is rebuilt

[atomicwaste12]

Can someone confirm that the Qing deal has been signed and when did this happen and how do esteemed members know the deal is 'basically' free?

[waz]

 atomicwaste12, on 09 March 2012 - 05:49 AM, said:

Can someone confirm that the Qing deal has been signed and when did this happen and how do esteemed members know the deal is 'basically' free?

The Pakistani Navy chief has denied the deal in an interview a week ago. He stated that the U214 deal is still also on the table.

[ISI2003]

 atomicwaste12, on 09 March 2012 - 05:49 AM, said:

Can someone confirm that the Qing deal has been signed and when did this happen and how do esteemed members know the deal is 'basically' free?

previous defense deals have been on "soft" loans ... pay as much as you can  ... no real interest on the loans ... but eventually if it can't be afforded alot of the loan gets "forgiven" hence free

the 50 JF-17 on emergency basis becomes 50 free jf-17

in this way Pakistan will pay some for the qing class subs, but in a way Pakistan operating the subs is an advertisement for the chinese shipyards
just like the j-10b and jf-17 in the PAF service will be an advertisement for the chinese aerospace industry

the f-22p frigates are an advertisement for the chinese shipyards and now the bangladeshi navy and the other navies are showing interest in this class of frigates

[atomicwaste12]

Thank you for your replies. In my humble opinion and it is indeed humble, Pakistan needs a decent submarine fleet. both numbers and quality. The U214 is by the limited details we can obtain from the internet a great diesel boat and would add a potent punch to the navy's offensive capabilities. The qing class would be copies of Russian subs and these in decent numbers can be lethal. Though I am worried by Russia's tendency to make shoddy stuff, however the Chinese who have been involved with Western practices in other areas of their great leap forward would understand and be prepared to improve the engineering and workmanship of these boats. At Chinese prices or as gifts these are a great punch per dollar ships and we should welcome them at the earliest opportunity. Not that we have much choice considering the shambles our economy is in thanks to the WoT and an incompetent and impotent government.

[khh]

I guess we need to go for the Qing class subz as soon as possible even we have the U214 still on the table...but U214 is on the table for the last 10 years and didn't materialized yet so can't wait for so long, needz alternatives for it as B plans, all the times shold be in place to keep the backup ...cuz the case is the price of our country.....

[Dizasta]

Pakistan Navy needs to have an enhanced modernization program, whereby the Navy is able to expand it's submarine fleet to at least 12, surface fleet to at least 18 and have sufficient support ships like replenishment-tankers, mine-hunters, patrol-boats, missile boats and hover-crafts. Additionally, Pakistan Navy ought be given the ability to build up it's Air-Detachment, which would include fighter-jets, reconnaissance-aircraft and early-warning airborne radar aircraft.

[SUPARCO]

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