India Tested Agni-3 Missile 3,000km Range, what level compare with China Options

[eachus]

Wow, India tested Agni-3 Missile 3,000km range and how good is it?
Agni-3 is more or less similar Chinese 1964 DF-3a missile has been retired.
50 tons weight, targets 3,000km. yes, that is the best India has.


Agni-3 spec
===========
Configuration: Two-stage, solid propellant
Length: 17.00m
Diameter: 2.00m
Launch weight: 50,000 kg
Range: 3,000km
payload: 1,500 kg


=========compare with Chinese missiles===========

DF-31
------------
Configuration Three-Stage, solid propellant
Diameter [meters] 2.0
Mass [kilograms] 20,000 kg
First Flight 29 April 1992
IOC 2000
Deployment Mobile
Range (km) 8,000 km
Re-entry Vehicle Mass (kg) 700 kg


JuLang 1 (CSS-N-3) Submarine-Launched Ballistic Missile
--------------------------------------
Configuration: Two-stage, solid propellant
Deployment: Submarine launch
Length: 10.70 m
Diameter: 1.34 m
Launch weight: 14,700 kg
Range: 1,700km (JL-1); 2,500km (JL-1A)
Re-entry vehicle mass: 600kg
Warhead: One single 200~1,000kT


DF-3A entered service 1964
---------------------------
Status: retired in 2002
Configuration: one-stage
Length: 24.00 m
Diameter: 2.25 m
Launch weight: 63,843 kg
Range: 2,800km
payload: 2,140 kg

[Martian]

Wow, India tested Agni-3 Missile 3,000km range and how good is it?
Agni-3 is more or less similar Chinese 1964 DF-3a missile has been retired.
50 tons weight, targets 3,000km. yes, that is the best India has.


Agni-3 spec
===========
Configuration: Two-stage, solid propellant
Length: 17.00m
Diameter: 2.00m
Launch weight: 50,000 kg
Range: 3,000km
payload: 1,500 kg


=========compare with Chinese missiles===========

DF-31
------------
Configuration Three-Stage, solid propellant
Diameter [meters] 2.0
Mass [kilograms] 20,000 kg
First Flight 29 April 1992
IOC 2000
Deployment Mobile
Range (km) 8,000 km
Re-entry Vehicle Mass (kg) 700 kg


JuLang 1 (CSS-N-3) Submarine-Launched Ballistic Missile
--------------------------------------
Configuration: Two-stage, solid propellant
Deployment: Submarine launch
Length: 10.70 m
Diameter: 1.34 m
Launch weight: 14,700 kg
Range: 1,700km (JL-1); 2,500km (JL-1A)
Re-entry vehicle mass: 600kg
Warhead: One single 200~1,000kT


DF-3A entered service 1964
---------------------------
Status: retired in 2002
Configuration: one-stage
Length: 24.00 m
Diameter: 2.25 m
Launch weight: 63,843 kg
Range: 2,800km
payload: 2,140 kg

India finds itself in the unfortunate position of being too far behind the technological curve. China isn't too concerned about the Indian Agni-3 missile. China knows that India would never fire an Agni-3 across the Himalayas.

Reason #1: China has midcourse Ground-based Interceptors (i.e. GBIs) that can be located in Tibet to shoot down Agni-3s headed for China's eastern cities. See first newslink below.

Reason #2: China probably has classified Nike-class nuclear-tipped interceptors to shoot down Agni-3s. See second newslink below.

Reason #3: After firing the first salvo of Agni-3s, there won't be anyone left in India to fire the next salvo. See http://www.fas.org/blog/ssp/2008/05/extens...ntral-china.php

http://www.globalsecuritynewswire.org/gsn/...100114_5918.php

"China Said to Close Gap With U.S. Missile Defense in Monday Test
Thursday, Jan. 14, 2010

China's missile defense test on Monday made it the second country to destroy an incoming missile target beyond the Earth's atmosphere, the South China Morning Post reported (see GSN, Jan. 12).

The United States was the first state to demonstrate such a capability, according to the report.

Beijing's accomplishment is proof of its advanced missile defense capabilities and also shows that it now has sophisticated radar technology, the newspaper stated.

Three years ago, China took the international community by surprise when it targeted and shot down one of its old weather satellites with a missile (see GSN, Jan. 19, 2007). This led to worries that the country might seek to remove the satellites of other nations.

The 2007 event was a much simpler feat than Monday's test as the satellite's flight course was known beforehand and because it had no protective capabilities, said retired People's Liberation Army Gen. Xu Guangyu.

This week's missile interception was more complicated as the incoming target's high velocity allowed only minutes for identified and targeted and for an interceptor to be fired."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nike_Ajax#Nike_Ajax

"Nike Hercules

A Nike Hercules missile.
Main article: MIM-14 Nike-Hercules

Even as Nike Ajax was being tested, work started on Nike-B, later renamed Nike Hercules (MIM-14). It improved speed, range and accuracy, and could intercept ballistic missiles. The Hercules had a range of about 100 miles (160 km), a top speed in excess of 3,000 mph (4,800 km/h) and a maximum altitude of around 100,000 ft (30 km). It had solid fuel boost and sustainer rocket motors. The boost phase was four of the Nike Ajax boosters strapped together. In the electronics, some vacuum tubes were replaced with more reliable solid-state components.

The missile also had an optional nuclear warhead to improve the probability of a kill. The W-31 warhead had four variants offering 2, 10, 20 and 30 kiloton yields. The 20 KT version was used in the Hercules system. At sites in the USA the missile almost exclusively carried a nuclear warhead. Sites in foreign nations typically had a mix of high explosive and nuclear warheads. The fire control of the Nike system was also improved with the Hercules and included a surface-to-surface mode which was successfully tested in Alaska. The mode change was accomplished by changing a single plug on the warhead from the "Safe Plug" to "Surface to Air" or "Surface to Surface".

The Nike Hercules was deployed starting in June 1958. First deployed to Chicago, 393 Hercules ground systems were manufactured. By 1960 ARADCOM had 88 Hercules batteries and 174 Ajax batteries, defending 23 zones across 30 states. Peak deployment was in 1963 with 134 Hercules batteries not including the US Army Hercules batteries deployed in Germany, Greece, Greenland, Italy, Korea, Okinawa, Taiwan, and Turkey."

[chengdusudise]

eachus, from the datas you provid, i think the agni -3 is similiar to DF3A missle, the most different between them is that the DF3A entered service in 1964 and agni 3 still in testing phase in 2010.
so, is it means 50 years tech gap?

[Machao]

I don’t think Agni-3s is really a threat unless China wants to have a long march to New Delhi, beside boundaries issue there is not strategic interests to go deep into India territory, to have Indians as Chinese citizens? I don’t think so, we have so many mouths to feed, lol.

[eachus]

military weapon has 2 priorities --- performance and reliabilities.
beside the performance such as low efficient engine and design make missile over weight and short ranges. the Indian Agni has another issue is low success rates. If performance and reliability can not meet at the same time, Chinese has tendency to choose the last one. China has good record on tests --- missiles, rockets,,, Indians do not care reliabilities since they are too far behind the game.

If high tech weapons(parts) can not purchase from other countries, India is about 30 years to 50 years behind China in most tech we know.

[eachus]

over 3,000km range is strategic weapon. the power of these weapon is before launching. China must show India that India have 0% chance to win China to prevent a war.
India has number of disadvantages compare to China.

1) India technology is left in dust, decades behind China. the weapon performance has no comparison.
2) India has some weapons, but they are not sure those are working functionally.
3) size effect, China is 5 times larger in budget and economic. China buys home made in quality yet at extremely low costs. India imports those at high prices.
4) Tibet is a God giving advantage to China. Tibet to India capital is 400s km, India to Chinese capital is 3500 km. the distance is 10 times, however strategy missile is 50 times cost of the 400 km missiles.

[M_ZEE32]

Wow, India tested Agni-3 Missile 3,000km range and how good is it?
Agni-3 is more or less similar Chinese 1964 DF-3a missile has been retired.
50 tons weight, targets 3,000km. yes, that is the best India has.


Agni-3 spec
===========
Configuration: Two-stage, solid propellant
Length: 17.00m
Diameter: 2.00m
Launch weight: 50,000 kg
Range: 3,000km
payload: 1,500 kg


=========compare with Chinese missiles===========

DF-31
------------
Configuration Three-Stage, solid propellant
Diameter [meters] 2.0
Mass [kilograms] 20,000 kg
First Flight 29 April 1992
IOC 2000
Deployment Mobile
Range (km) 8,000 km
Re-entry Vehicle Mass (kg) 700 kg


JuLang 1 (CSS-N-3) Submarine-Launched Ballistic Missile
--------------------------------------
Configuration: Two-stage, solid propellant
Deployment: Submarine launch
Length: 10.70 m
Diameter: 1.34 m
Launch weight: 14,700 kg
Range: 1,700km (JL-1); 2,500km (JL-1A)
Re-entry vehicle mass: 600kg
Warhead: One single 200~1,000kT


DF-3A entered service 1964
---------------------------
Status: retired in 2002
Configuration: one-stage
Length: 24.00 m
Diameter: 2.25 m
Launch weight: 63,843 kg
Range: 2,800km
payload: 2,140 kg

Some thing that I noticed that the Indian Missiles weight way more than the chinease and that China once had those missiles with same weight class but they are decommissioned now. And even Pakistani Shaheen-II with 2,500KM range weight is 25,000 Kg

[eachus]

Pakistani Shaheen-II missile may have some Chinese blood.

[eachus]

Missed some info in previous message.

Indian Agni-3 max speed = 5-6km/s around 4-5 Mach.


Chinese DF-21 development was completed around 1985-86.
Df-21A was operational by 1996,
------------
Configuration 2-Stage, solid propellant
Length: 10.70 m
Diameter: 1.4 m
Mass [kilograms] 14,700 kg
Deployment Mobile
Range (km) 2,500 km
Warhead 1 Nuclear, 200-300 KT
Speed Mach 10 ======( around 11 km/s, 2 times of Agni-3 )

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DF-21


Speed 1 mach = 1,225 km/s at sea level.

[M_ZEE32]

if am not wrong then mach one is about 333m/s and that's roughly about .3KM/s !

[cutty]

There is no need for China to compare long range missiles with India.
To attack New Delhi from China, any short range missiles, or some long range artilleries will do the job. (IMG:style_emoticons/PDFEmotionIconsv10/LOLANI.GIF)

[lanc]

Missed some info in previous message.

Indian Agni-3 max speed = 5-6km/s around 4-5 Mach.

???

5-6 km would be Mach 17 - Mach 20 not 4-5 Mach.

[M_ZEE32]

Naver mind ! that simple math once you know the definition of mach ! I think 1km/s is roughly 3 mach !

[lanc]

Naver mind ! that simple math once you know the definition of mach ! I think 1km/s is roughly 3 mach !

It varies with temperature and density but one can roughly assume it to be 340 m/s at sea level. So yes, 1km/s would be roughly Mach 3.

[eachus]

correction, Speed 1 mach = 1,225 km/h at sea level.
it is hourly speed, not sec.


JL-2 has operational range 8,000 km and speed in between the first (7.9 km/s) and second (11.2 km/s) escape velocities.
JL-2 and DF-31 have similar speeds, DF-21A is earlier version has less.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JL-2

[Capricorn]

Firing off missile claims
February 12 2010 Global Times

Military strategists in Beijing SHRUGGED off concerns Thursday of India's alleged ambitions to drastically enlarge its missile-striking distance to reach as far as the northernmost parts of China, as well as New Delhi's latest claim that it was far ahead of Beijing in interceptor technology.

India is set to test within a year an Agni-V nuclear-capable missile with a range of more than 5,000 kilometers, the country's chief military scientist, V.K. Saraswat, said Wednesday.

Its current longest-range missile capable of carrying nuclear warheads, the Agni-III, can travel a maximum of 3,500 kilometers and is now ready for use by the military, Saraswat said.

If launched from near the Line of Actual Control, the solid-fueled Agni-V will be able to hit Harbin, the capital of northeastern Heilongjiang province, a TNN report said Thursday.

Both the Agni-III and Agni- V will add muscle to India's "dissuasive deterrence" position on China, TNN said.

Authorities said the pair would be able to carry 1.5-ton conventional or nuclear warheads.

"We feel our accuracy is better than China's DF 21," Saraswat said of the Agni-III, a "China-specific deterrent", according to India's The Telegraph on Wednesday.

The DF-21 is China's mid-range missile that debuted in 1999, along with its intercontinental ballistic missile, the DF- 31, which the army utilizes.

Chinese Rear Admiral Zhang Zhaozhong, a professor at the Chinese National Defense University, said India is still 10 to 15 years BEHIND China IN TERMS of missile technology.

"It's still unknown when the Agni-III will be deployed by the Indian army, though they claim the missile is ready for use. And it MIGHT TAKE AT LEAST another five years to ready the Agni-V," Zhang said. "In developing its military technology, China HAS NEVER taken India as a STRATEGIC RIVAL, and none of its weapons were specifically designed to contain India."

The Agni-III was first tested in 2006 and brings major Chinese cities such as Shanghai and Beijing within striking distance, Indian reports said.

The Agni-III is "a real mobile system, and hence it has a strategic advantage," Saraswat said.

The government scientists said the Agni-III was declared operational after three flight tests. The most recent test was held Sunday. Chander said the Agni-III, which he called a "100-percent indigenous system," hit its "target with pinpoint accuracy and met all mission objectives."

India previously said it may seek to develop an intercontinental ballistic missile, but Saraswat said no efforts are currently being put into developing such a project.

In the meantime, Saraswat said its ballistic missile defense (BMD) could better defend itself from missile attacks.

"This (BMD) is one area where we are ahead of China. … We have been working on this program since 1999," Saraswat was quoted by the Hindustan Times as saying.

But that assertion was DOWNPLAYED, as Zhang said the BMD accounts for only part of India's interception system, which also encompasses early-warning and guidance systems.

"India's technology for its measurement and control system, which is used to trace launched missiles, remains at a very LOW LEVEL, and they are UNABLE to constitute a COMPLETE and RELIABLE missile defense system," Zhang said.

But Indian top military scientist Saraswat said advances have been made in developing "endo-atmospheric and exo-atmospheric intercept systems to destroy incoming hostile missiles within and outside the at-mospheric limits, respectively."

The integrated exo- and endo-atmospheric systems offer a hit-to-kill probability of 99.8 percent, the Hindustan Times said.

Beijing test-fired its first missile interception system last month and successfully tested its anti-satellite system in 2007.

Details of China's first ground-based mid-course missile-interception system were limited, but the official Xinhua News Agency said the test achieved its "expected objective."

The United States and Russia are the only two countries that have actually deployed mis-sile-interceptor technology.

Rear Admiral Yang Yi, at the University of National Defense, said, "Some Indian politicians, however, always depict China as an imaginary enemy in order to develop nuclear missiles and submarines, which only REFLECTS THEIR LACK OF CONFIDENCE and dwelling on historical problems," Yang said.

India is among the top 10 military spenders, with an annual defense budget last year of more than $30 billion, consultancy firm KPMG said.

"Whether they are rising peacefully (a self-confident China), truculently (an imperially nostalgic Russia) or boastfully (an assertive India, despite its internal multiethnic and religious vulnerabilities), they all desire a change in the global pecking order," Zbigniew Brzezinski said in the Septem-ber/October 2009 issue of Foreign Affairs.

[eachus]

== The DF-21 is China's mid-range missile that debuted in 1999, along with its intercontinental ballistic missile, the DF- 31, which the army utilizes.


what is debute? DF-21 is about to retire. wikipedia web site showed it was completed 1985 and operational by 1991.
when Agni-3 complete testing, DF-21 is already in museum. The the time Agni-3 lose weight to 20s tons, that will have better match the antique.

[atlantis]

== The DF-21 is China's mid-range missile that debuted in 1999, along with its intercontinental ballistic missile, the DF- 31, which the army utilizes.


what is debute? DF-21 is about to retire. wikipedia web site showed it was completed 1985 and operational by 1991.
when Agni-3 complete testing, DF-21 is already in museum. The the time Agni-3 lose weight to 20s tons, that will have better match the antique.

It's the DF-21B that debuted in 1999 and the DF-21C that debuted in 2009.

Although all called DF-21x, they are actually not the same generation mid-range missile.

[M_ZEE32]

Ageed with post 18 and 14 !