76 replies to this topic

[F-104Starfighter]

At number 2 becuase LCA is actually a good target practise for pakistani SAMs.Where else can we finder a better aircraft to shoot.

Its not that bad after all lol......

[crazyinsane105]

Which idiot voted for the Gripen/F-16 section? Seriously, that person needs to get a life!!!

[lil Paki]

I say the LCA at least equal to JF-17 and just being a Pakistani I would say below the JF-17

[awais786]

on paper,LCA is suppose to be as good as F-22,but in reality JF-17 is better then LCA in every way[and i am not saying this cause iam pakistani,the reports says it ]
and JF-17 will be upgraded later on while only 40 LCA will be ever made
so i too say 2

[Ted Cyr]

I say LCA deserves a 1 rating.

It SUCKS, period.

[hassan]

one voter give it 10        
               as it takes  time  so 2........better then thunder or not time ll tell us.besides that don`t ever think about rafale/flacon/gripen...................the best vote for LCA is 2.thats all

[_killuminati_]

LCA is too ugly to be rated.  Someone should post a pic of it on the uglyornot.com website.

[firepilot]

on paper,LCA is suppose to be as good as F-22,but in reality JF-17 is better then LCA in every way[and i am not saying this cause iam pakistani,the reports says it ]
and JF-17 will be upgraded later on while only 40 LCA will be ever made
so i too say 2

Not sure what paper you were reading it on.  Did that same paper have any smokable plants..haha

[Warcraft]

grow up and discuss things more of value. i think the mods have gone to hell to allow such childish behaviour.

Can anyone refute the claim made by the newspaper above w/o flames ?

[BruteBhangee]

Its Defence Ministers comments. Its true.

[YashK]

The LCA is superior to the JF-17 in every independent article I've read here and in the discussions on this forum.

I hope your military planners aren't as stupid as the members on this forum.

[amaccpc]

I hope your military planners aren't as stupid as the members on this forum.

military generals dont underestimate anyone strong or weak

[Dizasta]

The LCA is superior to the JF-17 in every independent article I've read here and in the discussions on this forum.

I hope your military planners aren't as stupid as the members on this forum.

I hope you ain't as stupid as you seem, in pushing your pathetic luck, indian. lca is better or worse than the Thunders, let time be the decider for that. Lets not judge till the fighters are in the air & up against each other in a real air-combat environment. So watch you mouth!

Edited by Dizasta76, 04 May 2005 - 07:02 AM.

[awais786]

Not sure what paper you were reading it on.  Did that same paper have any smokable plants..haha

i am being sarcastistic
what i mean is that the bhindias say that their LCA is sooooo goooood that its the best one around while in real life LCA  cant even kill a fly with its misliess and all let alone onther fighter planes

[Saqr]

The LCA is superior to the JF-17 in every independent article I've read here and in the discussions on this forum.

I hope your military planners aren't as stupid as the members on this forum.

Name 3, otherwise your post is BS, and sad too.

[lil Paki]

I bet you the articles he finds are one sided.

[Mig29Lover]

The LCA is superior to the JF-17 in every independent article I've read here and in the discussions on this forum.

I hope your military planners aren't as stupid as the members on this forum.

And may I ask for those articles???????

Don't tell me that u read them on Indian News ok???

And guess what???? U r a member of this forum too man!!!!     

[F-104Starfighter]

You mother fucker indian LCA( Lallu Chutto Allu ) can never ever compete JF-17 in quality it is the most ugliest aircraft ever to be made and it also will be flied by an asshole bhindian you fucked up indian

Their pilots flying LCA...some1 take care of our lightpoles.

Edited by F-104Starfighter, 05 May 2005 - 06:11 PM.

[Warcraft]

Name 3, otherwise your post is BS, and sad too.

LCA has a quadruple fly by wire system
FC1 has a analog and according to sinodefence, digitial fly by wire system
http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/fighter/fc1.asp

Max g limit on the LCA is +9/-3.5
Max g limit on the FC1 is 8
http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/fighter/fc1.asp

Thrust to weight ratio for LCA (max weight): 9.81
Thrust to weight ratio for FC1 (max weight) :6.41
http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/fighter/fc1.asp
( Based on 83.4 kN GTRE GTX-35VS augmented turbofan for LCA and the RD-93 turbofan for FC1 both shall/shall not be the future engines but for now this is what we have as nothing is finalilzed)

Wing loading for LCA (max) : 221.35kg/m^2
http://www.airtoaircombat.com/detail.asp?id=17
Wing loading for FC1 (max) : 552.17 kg/m^2
http://www.aeronautics.ru/fc1.htm


And all the ignorant idiots who do not know how the flight parameters such as Thrust to weight ratio and the wing loading effects the flight program stay out of this conversation.

And im sure pretty much everyone will be forced to ignore the above.

[Kim Jong-il Hater]

Let's congratulate India on the LCA, it's going to be a pretty good fighter, but it won't be able to surpass the JF-17. It's a decent plane though, and I think we should be proud....TO SHOOT IT DOWN!!!  

[YashK]

Let's congratulate India on the LCA, it's going to be a pretty good fighter, but it won't be able to surpass the JF-17. It's a decent plane though, and I think we should be proud....TO SHOOT IT DOWN!!! 

classical pakistani ignorance.

[lil Paki]

classical pakistani ignorance.

To tell you the truth I dont think Kim is a Pakistani

[waqas_2365]

The LCA is superior to the JF-17 in every independent article I've read here and in the discussions on this forum.

I hope your military planners aren't as stupid as the members on this forum.

OKAY YASHK..........I DONT KNOW WHO U R ....BUT LET ME TELL YOU WHAT MAKES LCA SO ATTRACTIVE

1. ITS BEING MADE BY PRIVATE OR NON MILLITARY COMPANIES......SO THEY R ADVERTISING IT AS MUCH AS THEY CAN ........ THEY SORT OF INFORMATION AVAILABLE ABOUT LCA IS NOT AVAILABLE ABT THUNDER

2. LCA MAY BE OR IT IS A BETTER AIRCRAFT MEANS USE OF COMPOSITES...AND FLIGHT RELATED AVIONICS BUT IT IS NOT A BETTER WAR MACHINE....... BETTER TELL ME ABOUT HOW IT WILL BETTER THUNDER IN WAR.....?

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S

[YashK]

OKAY YASHK..........I DONT KNOW WHO U R ....BUT LET ME TELL YOU WHAT MAKES LCA SO ATTRACTIVE

1. ITS BEING MADE BY PRIVATE OR NON MILLITARY COMPANIES......SO THEY R ADVERTISING IT AS MUCH AS THEY CAN ........ THEY SORT OF INFORMATION AVAILABLE ABOUT LCA IS NOT AVAILABLE ABT THUNDER

2. LCA MAY BE OR IT IS A BETTER AIRCRAFT MEANS USE OF COMPOSITES...AND FLIGHT RELATED AVIONICS BUT IT IS NOT A BETTER WAR MACHINE....... BETTER TELL ME ABOUT HOW IT WILL BETTER THUNDER IN WAR.....?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

S

lol, what makes you think it isn't a better war machine? There is hardly anything that the LCA isn't superior or equal to in your aircraft, but yet it is better? That's once again a classical example of pakistani stupidity.

As far as data being available, that's your problem that it isnt available. The good thing about India's LCA program is that information is available and it allows for continuous scrutiny and improvment. I don't see how India is advertising the LCA by making info on it available. I guess since everything indicates a superior aircraft, you perceive it as advertising and choose to hide instead or rubbish facts.

The fact is that the LCA is an indigenous Indian programme, a very small fraction of the components are being sources (mainly Israeli avionics). Even LCA's upcoming engine would be fabricated in India (kaveri). LCA is laying the platform not only for a solid fighter (and one of the cheapest in the world) but future Indian fighter jets built totally in India.

[viper007]

This has been discussed to death in Global thread.

LCA's design is superior to JF-17's and so its development time is also larger. FC-1 has a simpler design, and it has been made like this for a reason - to be inducted quickly.

Instead of wasting time on stupid claims, just read facts, some ppl do post them, but then you have to read them to make them count.

VIPER

[Kim Jong-il Hater]

To tell you the truth I dont think Kim is a Pakistani

I'm half! I hate Kim Jong-il after watching a documentry called "Children of the Secret State." It was very sad   . I am technically white (My Mom is American) but I'm half-Pakistani from my Dad's side. I have relatives in Quetta and some in Karachi. The LCA is a decent fighter but won't be able to take down a JF-17, especially when a Pakistani pilot is in the cockpit!

[switchblade]

I'm half! I hate Kim Jong-il after watching a documentry called "Children of the Secret State." It was very sad  . I am technically white (My Mom is American) but I'm half-Pakistani from my Dad's side. I have relatives in Quetta and some in Karachi. The LCA is a decent fighter but won't be able to take down a JF-17, especially when a Pakistani pilot is in the cockpit!

how does it make u "technically white" ?

[Yahya]

what on earth is a fly by wire system??? and how can it be quadroupled? i would love to know.

also i need some help with those ratios. in my book there is suppoed to be a : in the midle and two numbers on eaither side each representing something (in this case wieght:thrust r the other way around..not sure.)
following is an example of a ratio.

the wieght power ratio of this jet is 1:8... which translates into for every kilo there is 8 kilo thrust....(that figure is complete BS normaly they are 1:1.2 or somat.

. "The Rafale multi-role jet being inducted into the French Air Force and Navy, in turn, notches about Rs 270 crore."

i am sure a rafale can kill a lot more then the LCA. i mean a lot more....

hence the 3x larger price is cheaper to me.....going by Bang for buck...

[Momin-e-mubtila]

At number 2 becuase LCA is actually a good target practise for pakistani SAMs.Where else can we finder a better aircraft to shoot.

Its not that bad after all lol......

Why does the scale begin at zero?  It should start at -5.  LCA development will gobble up untold billions.  Only 5 or 10 will make it to production, making it the most expensive plane ever built.  That is why they are calling it the least expensive plane.  Such is the Hindu psyche.

LCA is like the Arjun, an enormous white elephant.  It will only waste money, and will provide no useful benefit to India.  Hence, the scale should start at -5.

[Warcraft]

what on earth is a fly by wire system??? and how can it be quadroupled? i would love to know.

also i need some help with those ratios. in my book there is suppoed to be a : in the midle and two numbers on eaither side each representing something (in this case wieght:thrust r the other way around..not sure.)
following is an example of a ratio.

the wieght power ratio of this jet is 1:8... which translates into for every kilo there is 8 kilo thrust....(that figure is complete BS normaly they are 1:1.2 or somat.
. "The Rafale multi-role jet being inducted into the French Air Force and Navy, in turn, notches about Rs 270 crore."

i am sure a rafale can kill a lot more then the LCA. i mean a lot more....

hence the 3x larger price is cheaper to me.....going by Bang for buck...

I will not argue about the Power To weight ratio number, since I do not know where you got that figure from, so I will assume that its Correct.

There is a difference in Power to Weight ratio namely (P/W) and Thrust to weight Ratio (T/W). let me explain further. In the below equation Sigma is the ratio between density at a given altitude and density at see level.

Therefore Sigma = Density of air at altitude you are flying at / Density of air at sea level

(P/W)(max)*sigma = [(T/W)(max)*sigma]*[Velocity of plane (a function of sigma)]

So as you can see, im assuming that your P/W ratio is correct but that does not mean my T/W ratio is incorrect either :)

Cheers !

btw as far as Quadruple FBW go, google it you will have enough answers.

[Yahya]

power to wieght ratio is thrust to wight ratio......

what is power in an aircraft?????
you doent have a v12 under the nosecone or soamt... it is thrust.

[Warcraft]

power to wieght ratio is thrust to wight ratio......

what is power in an aircraft?????
you doent have a v12 under the nosecone or soamt... it is thrust.

]

Silly boy, i cant even argue with you, knowing you dont know the Fundamental ABCD's of Aerodynamics.

The air density changes as a function of altitude which in turn changes the P/W ratio accordingly. If you are ignorant learn dont act Stubborn. There is no shame on being unware of something as long as you try to learn.

The car is something differnent as it travels on the same level and Air density ratio remains the same. Same is not the true of an airplane

Read my above post.

[Warcraft]

Leave Aerodynamics out of this.

Power = Thrust*Velocity

Here, this is the general equation.

[ISI2003]

first of all please provide sources on the figures you provided for the lca

secondly, the numbers provided for the fc-1 were probably that of the first prototype, if even that, as those numbers can be the calculation of the person running sinodefense

third if the numbers you provided for the lca are the final numbers on how the first protoypes are to perform, that is one thing, but the fc-1 has not finished development, and as seen recently it has been modified in certain critial areas, like the air intake which will increase air flow and increase the potiential twr for a more powerful engine

fourth the engine for the fc-1, the ws-13 is not ready yet but is expected soon, and the plane and engine have not been tested together so we don't know the TWR for the production model, or at least close to it, until they are tested together

fifth you said the fc-1's max g load is 8, while sindoefense classifies it as 8.5, and with some modifications, the fc-1 in the final pre-production model will probably reach a 9G level, if that is deemed nessecary

sixth the fc-1 has fly by wire, i don't have the source on this, but this was considered a nessecity and so the second model was the first prototype to feature it back in 2004

[firepilot]

India would be better off finishing the prototypes, but not producing it.  It will already be somewhat obsolete. FBW and glass cockpit does not make a first line fighter by itself.

Instead of producing LCA, they should just use the lessons learned towards MCA, but if they are going to produce something that is going to be obsolete as they role out of the factory, well thats their business.

[Warcraft]

first of all please provide sources on the figures you provided for the lca

secondly, the numbers provided for the fc-1 were probably that of the first prototype, if even that, as those numbers can be the calculation of the person running sinodefense

third if the numbers you provided for the lca are the final numbers on how the first protoypes are to perform, that is one thing, but the fc-1 has not finished development, and as seen recently it has been modified in certain critial areas, like the air intake which will increase air flow and increase the potiential twr for a more powerful engine

fourth the engine for the fc-1, the ws-13 is not ready yet but is expected soon, and the plane and engine have not been tested together so we don't know the TWR for the production model, or at least close to it, until they are tested together

fifth you said the fc-1's max g load is 8, while sindoefense classifies it as 8.5, and with some modifications, the fc-1 in the final pre-production model will probably reach a 9G level, if that is deemed nessecary

sixth the fc-1 has fly by wire, i don't have the source on this, but this was considered a nessecity and so the second model was the first prototype to feature it back in 2004

First of all, most of your post is mere speculation that things shall be different/improved. Please provide concrete sources that claim otherwise as in the same way I did.

Morover the FC-1 lacks a Quadruple FBW. its a Dual digital correct me if im wrong.

The engines taken into account were the ones they are being tested with. As you might notice I have quite convieniently left Kaveri out of this.

[Maratha]

India would be better off finishing the prototypes, but not producing it. It will already be somewhat obsolete. FBW and glass cockpit does not make a first line fighter by itself.

Nope. I would rate it as between f-16 blk 52+ and 60 tech-wise. You are right about the FBW and cockpit not making a good plane. Check the MMR specs, you will find they are comparable to the radr on F-16I.