232 replies to this topic

[Bilal Khan]

Rahul, I would love to stop seeing those Indian Fishermen/Women being eaten by Sharks and being exposed to bad chemicals and live on 6 USD a month before listening to your biast claims about the IAF.

[h177]

Where is craappy Russia

I hope Lull is not stupid enough to question the wisdom of US senators and

USAF officials.

http://www.reuters.c...storyID=4651279
Potential adversaries are pursuing "capabilities that threaten the dominance we enjoy today," Air Force Secretary James Roche said in prepared remarks to the panel. He mentioned China alone by name in this section of his remarks.

Beijing has purchased "significant numbers" of advanced surface-to-air missiles, he said, citing a risk of wider proliferation.

"China has also purchased, and is developing, advanced fighter aircraft that are broadly comparable to the best of our current frontline fighters," Roche added

[airforcefan]

H177

Amongst reasons given there it is clearly stated:

China purchased Advance SA missile system. This is reference to Russian missile systems.

Also in the other statement by the senator:

"China has also purchased, and is developing, advanced fighter aircraft that are broadly comparable to the best of our current frontline fighters," Roche added

Purchased fighters are none but russian. And if you can understand english then the term broadly comparable to the best of our current frontline fighters also includes them.

J-10 has deep israeli involvement:
http://www.uscc.gov/...ports/mair1.htm
"This opinion compares to widespread doubts in the West just a few years ago that the J-10 remained a viable program. The Salut official was also impressed with J-10 program and noted Israel’s deep involvement in the program."

According to your link J-10 is doubted as a viable program in west.

Even this link talks about deep israeli involvement in J-10. Definately super duper chicom needs great amount of russian and israeli development to make things broadly comparable to US.

[h177]

H177

Amongst reasons given there it is clearly stated:

China purchased Advance SA missile system. This is reference to Russian missile systems.

Also in the other statement by the senator:

"China has also purchased, and is developing, advanced fighter aircraft that are broadly comparable to the best of our current frontline fighters," Roche added

Purchased fighters are none but russian. And if you can understand english then the term broadly comparable to the best of our current frontline fighters also includes them.

J-10 has deep israeli involvement:
http://www.uscc.gov/...ports/mair1.htm
"This opinion compares to widespread doubts in the West just a few years ago that the J-10 remained a viable program. The Salut official was also impressed with J-10 program and noted Israel’s deep involvement in the program."

According to your link J-10 is doubted as a viable program in west.

Even this link talks about deep israeli involvement in J-10. Definately super duper chicom needs great amount of russian and israeli development to make things broadly comparable to US.

Airforcefan you have to read between the lines.

Beijing has purchased "significant numbers" of advanced surface-to-air missiles, he said, citing a risk of wider proliferation

He cleary put the importance of further proliferation meaning further development,

deployment and export of those systems. It is not static thing.

Even this link talks about deep israeli involvement in J-10. Definately super duper chicom needs great amount of russian and israeli development to make things broadly comparable to US.

As always Russian are ahead in Design and Israeli in Radar and Man-machine

interface but it cannot be true for future because of Large talent pool of Chines

and monetary resources as duly mentioned by USAF Sectary that China alone

is major threat.

[blackjar]

Something which gets the miss frequently in these my indegenous tech vs ur indegenous tech flame outs is that every bit of foreign collaboration is helping the aircraft achieve what was basically intended - a reasonably [if not greatly] potent aircraft vis-a-vis the competition.

After all thats what the air force wants - not a locally made tin can that can fly. So the war of words based on indegenous tech levels should be modified to factor in the effectiveness of the integration.

[airforcefan]

H177 you should understand this:
You only said:

Where is craappy Russia    

I hope Lull is not stupid enough to question the wisdom of US senators and

USAF officials.    

what made you say that ?

Russia was US enemy in reality unlike China which is only addressed as a potential rival. Potential being the key word. Which means its time before china can develop into one, at this point it just has the potential. Russia aka Soviet were never called potential.

And as i said mother russia feeding chinese baby. this article just proves that. and you are defeating the purpose of this thread to show china is great and russia a piece of crap.

and wat talent of chicom you are talking about ?? what have they made by themselves except making copies of israeli and russian stuff. the article clearly mentions how depenedent china is on russia for making it a military power.

this defeats the line you wanna establish russia crap and china great.

go beat your drums somewhere else.

Edited by airforcefan, 29 March 2004 - 07:12 PM.

[h177]

H177 you should understand this:
You only said:


what made you say that ?

Russia was US enemy in reality unlike China which is only addressed as a potential rival. Potential being the key word. Which means its time before china can develop into one, at this point it just has the potential. Russia aka Soviet were never called potential.

And as i said mother russia feeding chinese baby. this article just proves that. and you are defeating the purpose of this thread to show china is great and russia a piece of crap.

and wat talent of chicom you are talking about ?? what have they made by themselves except making copies of israeli and russian stuff. the article clearly mentions how depenedent china is on russia for making it a military power.

this defeats the line you wanna establish russia crap and china great.

go beat your drums somewhere else.

China was also enemy of US untill 1970s. Haven't you read the Korean war

and Vietnam war history?.

No body designate another country as rival with out full thought provoking process.

China is not only US military rival but also in economic field which poor Russians

could not do so. The reason US does not see Russia as rival because it does not

see any human, financial and military potential in it. Russia is thing of the past

now. I think you haven't read Moscowtimes articles where it is clearly mentioned

that if the current Engineers and Scientist becomes retired there is not enough

young people going into Military weopons research field to replace them. They

will soon run out of ideas and capacity to make things happen. Another important

thing to mention China may not need all the Russian weopons but it still has to

drop $1B to $2B every year on weopons just to make Russia happy because of its


vast natural resources need by China.

[h177]

h177

your purpose of opening this thread russia crap and china genius has been defeated. so stop whining.

US Senate has confirmed that China has the distinction of becoming a rival

and Russia is crap. So my purpose is served. (w00t) (w00t)

[h177]

h177 tere mein akal kam hai

go over this thread again from starting and tell me why did i said this statement.

here is another look this matter which country is emerging SuperPower.

http://www.nytimes.c...sia/22SPAC.html


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

January 22, 2004
The Next Space Race: China Heads to the Stars
By JIM YARDLEY and WILLIAM J. BROAD

EIJING, Jan. 21 — When President Bush outlined his ambitious vision last week for a new era of space exploration, one country in particular was on his mind as he extended an invitation for international cooperation: China.

In the last year, China succeeded in becoming only the third nation to put an astronaut into orbit, definitively signaling that it intends to break into the front rank of space explorers.

The Chinese plan to send more astronauts into space next year, to launch a Moon probe within three years, and are aiming to land an unmanned vehicle on the Moon by 2010, a half decade before the deadline President Bush set for the next Americans to arrive there.

The United States and China now stand at a critical juncture, between cooperation or competition, in what could be a costly and dangerous new space race that extends even beyond China.

Mr. Bush was deliberately reaching out to the Chinese, a senior administration official in Washington said. "The reference to international cooperation was not a throwaway line," said the official of the speech on Jan. 14. "It was an invitation. The president drew a day-night contrast. This is not the cold war."

But it could be. The Chinese are not alone in this new push to harness the power and prestige of space, which is fast becoming a necessary stop, like mastery of the atom, for aspiring global powers.


Joan Johnson-Freese, an expert the Chinese space program at the Naval War College in Rhode Island, said the Bush administration had no choice but to respond to China's recent successes with a space initiative.

"The success allowed China to reach out to other countries and they've been responding favorably, so we could not do nothing," she said in an interview. "While a space race is not a foregone conclusion, it is a possibility."

She added that the United States now had a window of opportunity for concord that might not last long. "Cooperation is the best position for the U.S. and the future," she said. "An inclusive vision will give the U.S. an opportunity to assume the mantle of leadership on a mission that could inspire the world."

The greatest concern is the militarization of space, using space-based weapons and satellites to extend the reach of nations or potential terrorists, and allowing more extensive and widespread intelligence gathering than ever before.

Such scenarios are central to the mistrust between the United States and China. Many American analysts note that China's manned space program falls under a wing of the People's Liberation Army, and suspect that China's primary ambitions in space are military.

Some analysts contend that China's manned space vehicle is specifically designed for potential military uses. The Chinese, meanwhile, saw the technological prowess displayed by the United States in Afghanistan and Iraq, and are now emphasizing the importance of "information warfare," with the need for a presence in space.

In October, People's Liberation Army Daily said outer space would become a "sphere of warfare" because space-based satellite technologies were critical for a swift, modern military.

"It's clear that the Chinese are worried about the U.S. domination of space, and that the U.S. considers China as a potential competitor," said Adam Segal, a senior China expert at the Council on Foreign Relations. "It's probably a good time to try to talk about these things since we haven't moved very far along in any of these plans."

President Bush never mentioned China by name in his address, but the administration official said that by not limiting his call to Europe and Russia he was implicitly reaching out to Beijing. Asked for comment on playing a possible role in Mr. Bush's Moon-Mars endeavor, China's Foreign Ministry answered in broad terms, noting that China is committed to collaborating with other space-faring nations, including the United States.

But the Foreign Ministry also hinted at past frustrations, noting that the Chinese space program has already sought — without success — a stronger relationship with NASA. Since 2002, the ministry noted, the two sides have been talking about a meeting of the heads of the two space agencies.

"We hope the realization of this meeting will present an opportunity for developing Chinese-American cooperation in the space sphere," the ministry said in a written statement.

Brian Harvey, author of the forthcoming "China's Space Program: From Conception to Manned Space Flight," said the United States had in the past excluded China on space issues, partly as political retribution for the 1989 Tiananmen Square crackdown. In one case, American officials denied visas for more than 50 Chinese officials to attend an annual meeting of the World International Space Congress held in Houston.

"The Chinese have felt very isolated," Mr. Harvey said.

Publicly, both American and Chinese officials now say the relationship is growing closer, even as frictions continue, particularly over Taiwan. Notably, the Chinese allowed Gen. Richard B. Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, to tour China's top-secret space command center in Beijing on the same day as Mr. Bush's speech on space.

The visit was part of a larger trip intended to build closer military ties. General Myers also met with his Chinese counterpart, Gen. Liang Guanglie, and later conferred with Jiang Zemin, the former Chinese president who remains in charge of the Chinese military.

At a news briefing, in a gesture to smooth tensions, General Myers was careful to praise China's successful launch last October. "Obviously, this is a big step for the Chinese space program, and we congratulate them," he said.

China has taken other important steps as well. It recently teamed up with the European Union on a new global satellite navigation system. In a different project, China and the European Space Agency launched a research satellite last month to study the Earth's magnetic fields, China's first such collaboration with developed countries, state news media reported. China has also joined with Brazil on satellite launches.

In all, China plans to launch 10 satellites this year, and a total of 30 by 2005; it currently has 16 in orbit. The satellites have scientific, commercial and military applications.

More bold are China's plans to build on the success of last year's Shenzhou 5 space orbit, and eventually to land on the Moon. Officials say next year's Shenzhou 6 mission is expected to carry two astronauts on a five- to seven-day space journey.

Efforts to reach the Moon are beginning in earnest this year, and some experts in the United States speak ominously of a "Red Moon" — the possibility that China might one day launch military astronauts into space with the aim of setting up a Communist lunar base.

Last March, Luan Enjie, director of the China National Aerospace Administration, described the Moon as "the focal point wherein future aerospace powers contend for strategic resources."

But Mr. Luan and other Chinese officials say China's lunar ambitions are wholly peaceful. Mr. Luan suggested that one of China's primary motivations for reaching the Moon was possible economic exploitation. He told People's Daily, the Communist Party's official newspaper, that China was also interested in developing lunar energy resources, like helium-3, a rare form of the element that scientists say could power advanced reactors on Earth.

In an interview this week, Ouyang Ziyuan, chief scientist for China's Moon program, said the program was part of China's larger efforts to become a leader in space.

"China has made a lot of achievements in satellite applications and manned space flight, but we haven't done much in deep space exploration," he said. "We need a breakthrough in this field to fill the gap. As a starting step, the Moon program is very necessary."

United States government documents, like the Air Force's Space Operations Doctrine and its Space Command's Strategic Master Plan, talk much about maintaining "space superiority" near Earth and even about using weapons in orbit. But they remain silent about the Moon.

"There is nothing in Air Force planning for the Moon," said Theresa Hitchens, vice president of the Center for Defense Information, a private research group in Washington.

Still, some analysts believe the Moon is part of a larger American military plan and interpreted Mr. Bush's speech as unilateral in emphasis, with echoes of the cold war.

"The Moon is a beachhead," said Alice Slater, director of the Global Resource Action Center for the Environment, a private group in New York. "It's the high ground from which they want to control space" she said of the Bush administration.

Bush administration officials say they are not worried that China's space achievements will undermine American prestige and leadership. Throwing open the door to Beijing on the Moon-Mars initiative, they added, stands to enhance American influence.

But the real potential for cooperation, the senior official said, "we're going to have to determine over time as China's activities unfold."

In the jubilant aftermath of the Shenzhou 5 flight, Chinese officials flirted with the notion of launching their own Mars mission by 2020. But this month, officials said any timetable was premature and that China was not yet far enough along to initiate such a program.

Meanwhile, the official Chinese news media have closely followed the exploits of the American robotic Mars explorer, Spirit, as have Chinese space officials.

"We have been always closely watching Mars exploration activities," Mr. Luan, the top space administrator said on the day Spirit landed. "We hope the U.S. mission will be a complete success in the days to come."


Jim Yardley reported from Beijing for this article and William J. Broad from New York.



Copyright 2004 The New York Times Company | Home | Privacy Policy | Search | Corrections | Help | Back to Top

[Lulldapull]

here is another look this matter which country is emerging SuperPower.

http://www.nytimes.c...sia/22SPAC.html


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

January 22, 2004
The Next Space Race: China Heads to the Stars
By JIM YARDLEY and WILLIAM J. BROAD

EIJING, Jan. 21 — When President Bush outlined his ambitious vision last week for a new era of space exploration, one country in particular was on his mind as he extended an invitation for international cooperation: China.

In the last year, China succeeded in becoming only the third nation to put an astronaut into orbit, definitively signaling that it intends to break into the front rank of space explorers.

The Chinese plan to send more astronauts into space next year, to launch a Moon probe within three years, and are aiming to land an unmanned vehicle on the Moon by 2010, a half decade before the deadline President Bush set for the next Americans to arrive there.

The United States and China now stand at a critical juncture, between cooperation or competition, in what could be a costly and dangerous new space race that extends even beyond China.

Mr. Bush was deliberately reaching out to the Chinese, a senior administration official in Washington said. "The reference to international cooperation was not a throwaway line," said the official of the speech on Jan. 14. "It was an invitation. The president drew a day-night contrast. This is not the cold war."

But it could be. The Chinese are not alone in this new push to harness the power and prestige of space, which is fast becoming a necessary stop, like mastery of the atom, for aspiring global powers.


Joan Johnson-Freese, an expert the Chinese space program at the Naval War College in Rhode Island, said the Bush administration had no choice but to respond to China's recent successes with a space initiative.

"The success allowed China to reach out to other countries and they've been responding favorably, so we could not do nothing," she said in an interview. "While a space race is not a foregone conclusion, it is a possibility."

She added that the United States now had a window of opportunity for concord that might not last long. "Cooperation is the best position for the U.S. and the future," she said. "An inclusive vision will give the U.S. an opportunity to assume the mantle of leadership on a mission that could inspire the world."

The greatest concern is the militarization of space, using space-based weapons and satellites to extend the reach of nations or potential terrorists, and allowing more extensive and widespread intelligence gathering than ever before.

Such scenarios are central to the mistrust between the United States and China. Many American analysts note that China's manned space program falls under a wing of the People's Liberation Army, and suspect that China's primary ambitions in space are military.

Some analysts contend that China's manned space vehicle is specifically designed for potential military uses. The Chinese, meanwhile, saw the technological prowess displayed by the United States in Afghanistan and Iraq, and are now emphasizing the importance of "information warfare," with the need for a presence in space.

In October, People's Liberation Army Daily said outer space would become a "sphere of warfare" because space-based satellite technologies were critical for a swift, modern military.

"It's clear that the Chinese are worried about the U.S. domination of space, and that the U.S. considers China as a potential competitor," said Adam Segal, a senior China expert at the Council on Foreign Relations. "It's probably a good time to try to talk about these things since we haven't moved very far along in any of these plans."

President Bush never mentioned China by name in his address, but the administration official said that by not limiting his call to Europe and Russia he was implicitly reaching out to Beijing. Asked for comment on playing a possible role in Mr. Bush's Moon-Mars endeavor, China's Foreign Ministry answered in broad terms, noting that China is committed to collaborating with other space-faring nations, including the United States.

But the Foreign Ministry also hinted at past frustrations, noting that the Chinese space program has already sought — without success — a stronger relationship with NASA. Since 2002, the ministry noted, the two sides have been talking about a meeting of the heads of the two space agencies.

"We hope the realization of this meeting will present an opportunity for developing Chinese-American cooperation in the space sphere," the ministry said in a written statement.

Brian Harvey, author of the forthcoming "China's Space Program: From Conception to Manned Space Flight," said the United States had in the past excluded China on space issues, partly as political retribution for the 1989 Tiananmen Square crackdown. In one case, American officials denied visas for more than 50 Chinese officials to attend an annual meeting of the World International Space Congress held in Houston.

"The Chinese have felt very isolated," Mr. Harvey said.

Publicly, both American and Chinese officials now say the relationship is growing closer, even as frictions continue, particularly over Taiwan. Notably, the Chinese allowed Gen. Richard B. Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, to tour China's top-secret space command center in Beijing on the same day as Mr. Bush's speech on space.

The visit was part of a larger trip intended to build closer military ties. General Myers also met with his Chinese counterpart, Gen. Liang Guanglie, and later conferred with Jiang Zemin, the former Chinese president who remains in charge of the Chinese military.

At a news briefing, in a gesture to smooth tensions, General Myers was careful to praise China's successful launch last October. "Obviously, this is a big step for the Chinese space program, and we congratulate them," he said.

China has taken other important steps as well. It recently teamed up with the European Union on a new global satellite navigation system. In a different project, China and the European Space Agency launched a research satellite last month to study the Earth's magnetic fields, China's first such collaboration with developed countries, state news media reported. China has also joined with Brazil on satellite launches.

In all, China plans to launch 10 satellites this year, and a total of 30 by 2005; it currently has 16 in orbit. The satellites have scientific, commercial and military applications.

More bold are China's plans to build on the success of last year's Shenzhou 5 space orbit, and eventually to land on the Moon. Officials say next year's Shenzhou 6 mission is expected to carry two astronauts on a five- to seven-day space journey.

Efforts to reach the Moon are beginning in earnest this year, and some experts in the United States speak ominously of a "Red Moon" — the possibility that China might one day launch military astronauts into space with the aim of setting up a Communist lunar base.

Last March, Luan Enjie, director of the China National Aerospace Administration, described the Moon as "the focal point wherein future aerospace powers contend for strategic resources."

But Mr. Luan and other Chinese officials say China's lunar ambitions are wholly peaceful. Mr. Luan suggested that one of China's primary motivations for reaching the Moon was possible economic exploitation. He told People's Daily, the Communist Party's official newspaper, that China was also interested in developing lunar energy resources, like helium-3, a rare form of the element that scientists say could power advanced reactors on Earth.

In an interview this week, Ouyang Ziyuan, chief scientist for China's Moon program, said the program was part of China's larger efforts to become a leader in space.

"China has made a lot of achievements in satellite applications and manned space flight, but we haven't done much in deep space exploration," he said. "We need a breakthrough in this field to fill the gap. As a starting step, the Moon program is very necessary."

United States government documents, like the Air Force's Space Operations Doctrine and its Space Command's Strategic Master Plan, talk much about maintaining "space superiority" near Earth and even about using weapons in orbit. But they remain silent about the Moon.

"There is nothing in Air Force planning for the Moon," said Theresa Hitchens, vice president of the Center for Defense Information, a private research group in Washington.

Still, some analysts believe the Moon is part of a larger American military plan and interpreted Mr. Bush's speech as unilateral in emphasis, with echoes of the cold war.

"The Moon is a beachhead," said Alice Slater, director of the Global Resource Action Center for the Environment, a private group in New York. "It's the high ground from which they want to control space" she said of the Bush administration.

Bush administration officials say they are not worried that China's space achievements will undermine American prestige and leadership. Throwing open the door to Beijing on the Moon-Mars initiative, they added, stands to enhance American influence.

But the real potential for cooperation, the senior official said, "we're going to have to determine over time as China's activities unfold."

In the jubilant aftermath of the Shenzhou 5 flight, Chinese officials flirted with the notion of launching their own Mars mission by 2020. But this month, officials said any timetable was premature and that China was not yet far enough along to initiate such a program.

Meanwhile, the official Chinese news media have closely followed the exploits of the American robotic Mars explorer, Spirit, as have Chinese space officials.

"We have been always closely watching Mars exploration activities," Mr. Luan, the top space administrator said on the day Spirit landed. "We hope the U.S. mission will be a complete success in the days to come."


Jim Yardley reported from Beijing for this article and William J. Broad from New York.



Copyright 2004 The New York Times Company | Home | Privacy Policy | Search | Corrections | Help | Back to Top

Yeah right, china comes into the space age belatedly, if not 50 years too late, and this makes Unkal sam shudder at the thought of communist panda's challenging it in deep space?

Abaay Hi-77, yaar tu aesa kar kay bhancho Black eagull force naal boht gehree dostee kar lay! I swear to God Black eagull force will be your best friend, and companion! Dono saath beth kar bhancho you guys will kick up an intense intellectual storm! boht zabardast!

[Willz]

at least China made it to space... unlike some countries...

i hope India will make it to space soon so they can beat the japs there..

we Chinese hate the japs the most.

[PAFpilot]

at least China made it to space... unlike some countries...

i hope India will make it to space soon so they can beat the japs there..

we Chinese hate the japs the most.

intra-racism.

[Lulldapull]

intra-racism.

Intra- Bhund, perhaps?

[rice]

Intra- Bhund, perhaps?

speak english, perhaps?

[rice]

Yeah right, china comes into the space age belatedly, if not 50 years too late, and this makes Unkal sam shudder at the thought of communist panda's challenging it in deep space?

Abaay Hi-77, yaar tu aesa kar kay bhancho Black eagull force naal boht gehree dostee kar lay! I swear to God Black eagull force will be your best friend, and companion! Dono saath beth kar bhancho you guys will kick up an intense intellectual storm! boht zabardast!

you must eat trash for breakfast, lunch, dinner and snack because that's about all that has ever come out of your mouth

when you're full, try brushing your teeth and then attempt not to stink up a conversation with your meaningless breath fart

[kataphraktoi]

speak english, perhaps?

oh my my....what do we have here?

An ABCD?....or perhaps ABCD brand of chawal?

[kataphraktoi]

H177,

You don't understand the reasoning behind all of these media stories in the US media about China. Pentagon needs bigger budget and they have to conjur up a threat perception from somewhere so as in order to justify the budget increase that they want. Naturally after the Cold War what better threat to play-up than "Red" China?

[ChineseTiger888]

H177,

You don't understand the reasoning behind all of these media stories in the US media about China. Pentagon needs bigger budget and they have to conjur up a threat perception from somewhere so as in order to justify the budget increase that they want. Naturally after the Cold War what better threat to play-up than "Red" China?

Unlike Russia, China really did fight America face to face

When China enter war with US, US was on China border. Now today, border is near Seoul. China reconquer ALL of N Korea from Americans. No other country have take the land from US forces. Even Vietnam fight until US leave on they own. But Chinese beat back Americans.

Russia never fight face to face with America.

China fight face to face with Russians too

Russia is all talk. They never really fight US.

It is funny only the Indians (and Lulli) come talk up Russia. India took beating from China too.

Today, China is second most powerful economy after US. Russia never could compete on economic.

Go to US store, see how many Russian stuff you will find and see how many Chinese

So US Senators know what they are talking about. They lose 50,000 died against China in Korea and another 50,000 in Vietnam next to China. You know why they did not invade North Vietnam? US was afraid China would enter war like in Korea. US never fear Russia intervention because they know Russia will not fight like in Cuba.

China will fight.

Anyway what do Indians know about world strategy? India is unimportant and no one cares. Why are you in this thread? This is about Chinese quality not Indian, Russia do not need Indian help.

Lulli can fight for Russia. You are hurting his arguments because people think he is Indian now because all you Indians are on his side

[rice]

oh my my....what do we have here?

An ABCD?....or perhaps ABCD brand of chawal?

sorry, i don't speak dumbass, translate please

[PakShaheen]

sorry, i don't speak dumbass, translate please

:megalol :megalol :megalol

[kataphraktoi]

sorry, i don't speak dumbass, translate please

translation is teri ####### par mera joota ka footprint

[h177]

Lull this is specially for you.
Russian economy totally dependent on Araanb people. What a joke
Would they not offer Su-35 on Silver plate (w00t)




http://www.moscowtim.../04/01/041.html
The Russian economy, heavily dependent on crude exports, would be affected by any radical change in Saudi oil policies, which is what seems to be happening now, said Alfa Bank chief strategist Chris Weafer, who has advised OPEC in the past. He said Riyadh is switching its focus from maintaining the market to generating cash to increase domestic spending in an attempt to secure the royal family's political position.

"High oil prices also create conditions for a rapid increase in supplies from non-OPEC countries like Russia," Weafer said

[MKI]

Go to US store, see how many Russian stuff you will find and see how many Chinese

Oh yeah! go to any Chinese air base and see how many russian jets are and how many chinese jets are there ::devill

Anyway what do Indians know about world strategy?  India is unimportant and no one cares.  Why are you in this thread?  This is about Chinese quality not Indian, Russia do not need Indian help. 

Dont you think chinese should learn english before they spell World Strategy

If India is unimportant then why are you replying to Indians

your talk just confirms the Chinese quality

[h177]

Lull. This is specially for you.
Russian defence minister blasts air force command over pilot training

Text of report by Russian news agency RIA

Moscow, 18 November: Russian Defence Minister Sergey Ivanov has sharply criticized the command of the Russian air force at a meeting of military top brass in Moscow.

"I would draw attention to the current situation in the area of aviation. Because of poor pilot training as well as the low technical level of aircraft, not a single aviation regiment of the air force meets the demands made of military units in a state of permanent readiness 100 per cent," Ivanov said.

"Of particular concern is the situation in the air force, where the problem of ensuring the required level of pilot training remains the most acute," he said. The average annual number of flying hours per pilot totals 12-44 while the minimum necessary is 160-180, he added.

He believes that it is for precisely this reason that the level of pilot training remains extremely low and prevents crews in the majority of military units from meeting their military objectives within echelons and squadrons. Crews are losing their flying skills at night-time and in marginal weather conditions, he said.

"The consequence of the pilot training situation has been a high aircraft accident rate," he said. According to his figures, there have been eight air accidents this year, five of which were disasters with the loss of 12 lives.

"Seven of these eight accidents were caused by pilot error and only one by technical malfunction," he said.

The air force really does lack modern technology, he said. He added, however, that the accident rate for old technology as a result of human negligence exceeds all conceivable bounds.

"How are we going to master the new military technology, which is already starting to come into the forces, if the accident rate on the old technology - and, I stress, not because of technical malfunction but because of human negligence and irresponsibility, at times simply criminal sloppiness and bravado - goes beyond all conceivable bounds?" he said.

"We don't need to look for excuses but to try and achieve absolute compliance with provisions of regulations and instructions," he said.

He asked the commander of the air force, Vladimir Mikhaylov, to make every effort to improve the situation and use all available resources to train pilot crews.

Russian defence minister blames numerous accidents on senior officers' sloppiness

Excerpt from report by Russian NTV on 18 November

[Presenter] Russian Defence Minister Sergey Ivanov has sharply criticized the level of combat readiness of the Russian Air Force. He said some harsh words about air force commanders and the quality of training received by military pilots. Since the beginning of this year there have been 10 accidents in the Russian Air Force, in which 23 people were killed. For the armed forces as a whole, over 300 servicemen have died this year as a result of accidents or crimes. Ivanov gave these figures speaking at a meeting of senior military commanders. The session is being attended by President [Vladimir] Putin. Our correspondent Dmitriy Kalenichenko is in a live two-way with the studio. Dmitriy, what other statements were made today?

[Correspondent] President Putin began his speech on an encouraging note, saying that the better part of the Defence Ministry's budget next year will be spent on combat training. [Passage omitted.]

Speaking on how to raise the combat efficiency of the armed forces, Putin also spoke about contract-based service. He demanded that the relevant agencies introduce tougher requirements as regards the recruitment of contract servicemen, both soldiers and sergeants. Here is what he said about the prospects of Russia having contract- based and professional armed forces.

[Putin] By the end of 2007 we must have armed forces that almost by half will be manned by contract servicemen. This will enable us to reduce the conscription term down to one year.

[Correspondent] Next to speak was the defence minister. First, he said that those contradictions and difficulties that were now emerging in the armed forces were primarily a result of the lack of understanding on the part of senior officers of the requirements that had been put forward in connection with the military reform - that the main priority was given to permanent-readiness units. Most criticism was levelled at the Russian Air Force.

[Sergey Ivanov] I draw your attention to the situation that has developed in the Air Force. Because of pilots' poor training and the poor state of repair of aircraft, not a single air force regiment or a naval aviation regiment meets by 100 per cent the requirements set for permanent-readiness military units.

[Correspondent] The defence minister went on to list the reasons for this state of affairs in the armed forces. He said that while many people, especially journalists, were saying that the armed forces needed new hardware and equipment, there were numerous violations in the way the existing, old equipment was being used. He blamed accidents and crashes on senior officers' sloppiness.

Ivanov also said that this year was the first when not a single soldier or sailor had taken part in the harvesting campaign. He described it as a positive development and said that in future improved combat training of the armed forces would result in fulfilling those tasks that had been set for him and the General Staff by the president.

[Video shows senior officers gathering for the meeting, the meeting in progress.]

[h177]

By JOHN J. LUMPKIN
Associated Press Writer

BEIJING (AP) -- It may look like Mission Control in Houston, but this space complex had been hidden from the world until Wednesday - when U.S. officials got their first look at the command center that recently sent China's first manned flight into orbit and back.

"Congratulations. You've had a great success," Gen. Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told Chinese space program officials during his 40-minute tour of the facility.

Like its storied U.S. counterpart at Houston's Johnson Space Center, Beijing Aerospace Control Center appears to be the technical, and perhaps inspirational, linchpin of its country's space program.

"Achieve the Chinese people's dream of flying in the sky," reads a banner in Chinese characters near one of three massive screens in the control room. Another banner reads, "Realize the complete success of the first manned space mission."

On Oct. 15, the space center did precisely that. After blasting off from the Gobi Desert, Taikonaut Col. Yang Liwei orbited Earth several times in a modified Russian Soyuz capsule before landing safely inside China's borders. The mission catapulted China onto the short list of countries - Russia and the United States - with manned spaceflight programs.



Like President Bush, who wants to establish a base on the Moon and a manned mission to Mars, Beijing envisions grander plans - for a space station and a lunar base. China has also announced a second manned mission to take place by 2005.

And like Bush, China regards its space program as a matter of prestige - though there are military purposes, particularly with intelligence-gathering satellites.

When the space control center here is running - it appeared almost deserted Wednesday - an operator at each station monitors one of the subsystems of the Chinese spacecraft. The central main screen has a world map with an overlay of the spacecraft's orbit. Rows of workstations, each with a Dell computer monitor, sit before the three big wall screens.

Until now, no foreign delegation had been allowed inside the Beijing Aerospace Control Center. A small group of reporters accompanied Myers but were not allowed to take photographs.

Myers and the delegation were also shown a brief video commemorating the flight and asserting that China's orbital capsule was more advanced than American or Russian models.

Access to such normally closed facilities is regarded as a good sign by American officials, and Myers' visit to China is part of an effort to rebuild military contacts with the communist country.

The turbulent U.S.-Chinese military relationship had been severely curtailed after U.S. bombs struck the Chinese embassy in Belgrade, Yugoslavia, during the 1999 air war over Kosovo.

They worsened in April 2001 when a Chinese fighter collided with a U.S. reconnaissance plane off the coast of China. They have gradually improved since then, and Myers is the highest-ranking military official to visit China during the Bush administration

[eachus]

==The Russian economy, heavily dependent on crude exports,


That is right.
Russian government calculates their annual spending based oil price. If the oil price stay above $20 which is a critical piont of Russian enconomic, then they will do good. anytime oil goes down $20, they are in trouble.

From current situation, the demand is larger than oil supply and will last for long time. So Russia get good chance to rebuild their shaking economics and have base to recover quickly. Russia back to certain piont will releast the political pressure on China. Because Russia has more benafit conflit with US than China. If Russia get too strong is not good for China an US.


Not much people care Russia lately. The relative strength leans to China, even US still in dominate position. by percentage of the world total power, Russia has smaller and smaller size. The new power is US-China-EU triangle, else are secondary players in predictable future.

[rice]

Oh yeah! go to any Chinese air base and see how many russian jets are and how many chinese jets are there ::devill

you'll find more j-11s than su-27s, if that's what you mean

on the other hand, in india...

[rice]

Dont you think chinese should learn english before they spell World Strategy      

If India is unimportant then why are you replying to Indians    

your talk just confirms the Chinese quality      

apparently you didn't do too well in english either. that coming from an indian, who was conquered and enslaved by the british and forced to speak english, that's a shame

he spelt 'world strategy' quite correctly, if anything you spelt it the same way

if india is so important why is no one calling india a rising world power? because it's not

in fact it can't even feed more than half of its population, which is growing out of sustainability with no effort for control

why fukk yourselves (literally) when you don't even have the food to feed your first child, let alone 10 children?

it is also the world's second largest aids nation. the problem being so serious, it was featured in the national geographic magazine, went on for 11 pages

the same magazine also featured a story on the cruelties of the caste system, which is, despite denial by indians, alive and well and reducing people to the level below animals

the truth is perhaps hard to swallow for indians, but the chinese are leaps ahead, that is no fiction, no boasting

it's simply true

so stop jerking off and daydream and talk #### and start doing something to improve your country, like, stop having 10 children that you can't feed

[Siddiqi]

Unlike Russia, China really did fight America face to face

When China enter war with US, US was on China border. Now today, border is near Seoul. China reconquer ALL of N Korea from Americans. No other country have take the land from US forces. Even Vietnam fight until US leave on they own. But Chinese beat back Americans.

Russia never fight face to face with America.

China fight face to face with Russians too

Russia is all talk. They never really fight US.

It is funny only the Indians (and Lulli) come talk up Russia. India took beating from China too.

Today, China is second most powerful economy after US. Russia never could compete on economic.

Go to US store, see how many Russian stuff you will find and see how many Chinese

So US Senators know what they are talking about. They lose 50,000 died against China in Korea and another 50,000 in Vietnam next to China. You know why they did not invade North Vietnam? US was afraid China would enter war like in Korea. US never fear Russia intervention because they know Russia will not fight like in Cuba.

China will fight.

Anyway what do Indians know about world strategy? India is unimportant and no one cares. Why are you in this thread? This is about Chinese quality not Indian, Russia do not need Indian help.

Lulli can fight for Russia. You are hurting his arguments because people think he is Indian now because all you Indians are on his side

I agree with u man, every body fears China bcoz it will fight it has been proven in the past. The USA knows that even if there where (GOD FORBID) a nuclear strike against China, China would be able to absorb it due to the size of its population and retaliate and possibly anialate the US population. :pkflg)

[Asian Union]

http://www.bbc.co.uk...siness-26043993

[Dizasta]

To the person who wrote this:

 

Unlike Russia, China really did fight America face to face. When China enter war with US, US was on China border. Now today, border is near Seoul. China reconquer ALL of N Korea from Americans. No other country have take the land from US forces. Even Vietnam fight until US leave on they own. But Chinese beat back Americans. Russia never fight face to face with America. China fight face to face with Russians too. Russia is all talk. They never really fight US. It is funny only the Indians (and Lulli) come talk up Russia. India took beating from China too. Today, China is second most powerful economy after US. Russia never could compete on economic. Go to US store, see how many Russian stuff you will find and see how many Chinese. So US Senators know what they are talking about. They lose 50,000 died against China in Korea and another 50,000 in Vietnam next to China. You know why they did not invade North Vietnam? US was afraid China would enter war like in Korea. US never fear Russia intervention because they know Russia will not fight like in Cuba. China will fight. Anyway what do Indians know about world strategy? India is unimportant and no one cares. Why are you in this thread? This is about Chinese quality not Indian, Russia do not need Indian help. Lulli can fight for Russia. You are hurting his arguments because people think he is Indian now because all you Indians are on his side.

 

The "Russian Federation" is not the former Soviet Union. The latter was a authoritarian, tyrannical state, controlled and run by Bolshevik Jews. Russians are NOT Jewish, they are Eastern Orthodox Church - Christians. The current Russian Federation is much more aware of it's global position, international relations and geo-politics. Compared to the former Soviet Union, the Russian Federation is focused on establishing itself as an economic power with military muscle to back it. 

 

The Russian Federation has shown clear intent to work with the international community and build relationships with other countries. Best examples of this intent, is in the BRICS consortium. Where the Russian Federation has taken great strides in developing relationships with countries of Latin America. Brazil and Venezuela are one of those countries where the Russian Federation seems to be increasing it's trade & commerce with. Another example is the SCO, where the Russian Federation is building it's relations with China and the Central Asian Republics.

 

As for the Russian Federation going head to head against the United States of America is concerned. Well, anyone with even half a brain would tell you that it is foolish thing to do by yourself. If you look America, you will see that they too have not gone into any conflict alone and the ones they did go it alone, they were defeated (Vietnam & Somalia). The Americans have NATO, which they have used effectively, as well as coalitions like in conflicts; Balkan War (1990-1999), Gulf Wars I/II, Libya and Afghanistan.

 

So if you are insinuating that China or Russia will be able to take on and defeat America, alone. You are living in a fools paradise my friend. 

 

Both the Russian Federation and the People's Republic of China have form a military alliance group along with friendly countries, to counter-balance NATO. Member states of this group would strive toward consolidating their economic clout and further develop their military capabilities. These member states would work towards achieving the capability to operate with the Russians & Chinese in future conflict, anywhere in the world. Also, this organization/group will have their equivalent of World Bank & IMF. Which would ensure immunity to any sort of sanctions imposed by the West. 

 

Only then, would the Sino-Russian alliance be able to subdue America-NATO.

 

Alone, they will perish.

[Dizasta]

http://www.bbc.co.uk...siness-26043993

 

That would be a good aircraft for Pakistan International Airline to use in it's domestic flight-ops, as well as regional ones like Dubai, Doha, Kuwait City, Tehran and etc. PIA really needs to be revamped from top to bottom. The organization is rife with lazy, fat, bribed 'n' bought criminals, who are draining away the life out of PIA like a bunch of leeches/parasites. 

[macau boy]

 

That would be a good aircraft for Pakistan International Airline to use in it's domestic flight-ops, as well as regional ones like Dubai, Doha, Kuwait City, Tehran and etc.

The C-919 is still a few years (delivery date) away and then follows by the long process of commercial certifications.

The smaller ARJ-21 is almost ready. The first copy is expected to handover to commercial customer before the end of this year.