29 replies to this topic

[instantexcess]

Well, i really wana know that the one in production in Pakistan ..... T-69IIP .... how good is that machines and what is it equalent to IA ?

[Kelsier]

I suggested making them Al-Zarrar...

[Major Saab]

there as good as the T-72 but there just the second line of deffence next to the T-85IIAP. Pakistan is concentrating more on making 500 AL-KHALIDS there superb there gonna be equipped with the AT-11 sniper 3000 of these missiles have been brought from countries over seas. This means IA military advantage over Pakistan has been bitterly reduced ounce again.

[topgunmann]

np this means that we have an edge over the indians in the field of armour.
Paksiatn Zindabad :devil :devil :devil

[lifeisfun]

if u speak abt missiles and armour, then india's Nag "anti tank" missile is capable to penetrate Al-Khalids armour! whats the big deal ?

well 500 AK's ?? over how many years? india is getting 124 Arjuns and prob same or more T-90's, (confirmed news).

[Kelsier]

Ummm lifeisfun, since when was India going to produce Arjun, last I checked it was a big failure.

[lifeisfun]

nope ameer....army is gonna procure it and they placed the order!

[instantexcess]

"well 500 AK's ?? over how many years? india is getting 124 Arjuns and prob same or more T-90's, (confirmed news). '

next 3 yr.s ! ( and that was back in 2001 when the production started after the arrival of the first batch of the 300 Transmisions and engines from ukraine)

[Einsteinuddin]

AT-11 sniper 3000 of these missiles have been brought from countries over seas

What is the source for this?

Here's Vassily Fofanov's site on Ukraine Armor on AT-11.

http://armor.kiev.ua...RM/refleks.html

The 9K119M Refleks-M (AT-11 SNIPER-B) is a guided weapons system launched from the 2A46M main gun of T-80 and T-90 MBTs. The 9K119M system uses beam-riding laser guidance. The tank directs a coded beam from a special gunner's sight, which creates a laser "funnel" with the missile riding in the center. The 9K119M uses the 9M119M missile. The ammunition round is 3UBK20 and consists of the 9M119M missile and the 9Kh949 reduced charge propellant casing with a spacer plug which seats the missile properly into the main gun. The 3UBK20 ammunition fits into the normal autoloader on the tank, and the normal load is 6 missiles. Due to high cost of the system, usually only elite regiments shall have the missiles in a loadout.

You tell me Pakistan found a money growing tree?

How the hell can they afford 3,000 of these man?

[instantexcess]

They stole teh cash off ur undies ..... if i give u a link ... will u STFU ?

cuz if u wont ( which i am very sure off ) ..... then there is no point to it !



anyways .... this is what i found on the short notice!


http://projects.sipr..._MTPS_92_01.pdf

OOOO and my bad ___ its not 3000 missiles .... its 4000 !! ( well almost ) and that is from one country , First order only !

so we can expect even more in the near future ... or recent past ...! haha !

[instantexcess]

Status:
In production and in service with China, Cyprus, Pakistan (T-80UD or T-84, made in Ukraine), South Korea, Russia and Ukraine.

http://www.google.ca...ang_en&ie=UTF-8

[lifeisfun]

IE,

It seems like Pak signed for 315 6-TD2 engines ($150 mill worth) somewhere this may 2002. so it'll take 3 m ore years to get the engines supplied.

Also how many AK's does pak army hav rite now? Janes says PA has 20 of em. the report is fairly new (JDW May 2002 )

Yes PA does has AT-11 Missiles with them, i guess chinese hav their own version which can be fired from their Type 98! also i think AT-11's performance on explosive armour! i guess t-90 and arjun has explosive armours!

[instantexcess]

That is the 2nd batch to my knowledge ... right now I gtg .... i should clarify this later!

[instantexcess]

Some 300 Al-Khalid tanks will be produced in the coming five years. Side by side with the manufacture of Al-Khalid,

http://www.google.ca...ang_en&ie=UTF-8

[troung]

Do you mean the Type 69?

[lifeisfun]

it says over the period of 5 years ( dated Aug 2001)! so if the ukranians give engines over the period of 3 years from (May 2002) when will they be ready? any idea ? how fast will HIT manufacture?
also need to consider the t-59's upgrade process!

[Einsteinuddin]

Instant,

The Sipri document says "Status Uncertain". So you still have no evidence that any of this made into Pak inventory.

Read the Sipri glossary:

http://projects.sipr...onventions.html

It says Any number within parantheses means uncertain or SIPRI estimate

Try again.

[instantexcess]

QUOTE  
Status:
In production and in service with China, Cyprus, Pakistan (T-80UD or T-84, made in Ukraine), South Korea, Russia and Ukraine.



http://www.google.ca...ang_en&ie=UTF-8

then again .... why am i even trying ....... u will continue denying !

so this is the last time,

believe or leave, dont waste my time!

[Einsteinuddin]

1. Ukraine itself is very unlikely to have 3,800 AT-11 missiles

2. Sipri says that the transfer is inconclusive and uncertain.

3. Global Security doesn;t list it in Pak inventory

http://www.globalsec...y-equipment.htm

4. Jane's doesn't list it in Pak's inventory (3,800). It says Pak has a "few"

5. Too expensive and out of Pak's budget.

[instantexcess]

5. Too expensive and out of Pak's budget.

where are u again? The finance ministry right ? in Pakistan ? u should be, do u even know the unit cost of the system ? if no right now, then STFU ( dont try to find a source, just ask urself, do u even know it? )

U know what, Pak has none, nope no AT-11, but when out of no where the missiles start getting injecting up ur **********, then worry about it right ! it would be great to find out of IA has the same denial attitude! just deny the it ! just deny it. btw the systems were bought from Belarus, which has nothing to do with what ukraine has! SIPRI is just not sure about the #.s! cuz unlike india, no country goes around naked..... ooo look, we got this, .... ooo we may have this ..... etc. etc. Janes gives a few right? and when was this janes updated again! the one u read?

[Einsteinuddin]

1. SIPRI says that the deal itself is inconclusive/unknown.

2. Jane's is dated May 2002.

3. Yeah we'll know ifyou guys have 4000 AT-11s, just like those F-16s and F-22s and AWACS etc.

4. Read this site:

http://armor.kiev.ua...RM/refleks.html

Even the Ukraine Army is using it only for elite regiments because of the high cost. But it is easy to see why Pak will use the same missile to quadruple their inventory

[PhrozenFlame]

1. SIPRI says that the deal itself is inconclusive/unknown.

2. Jane's is dated May 2002.

3. Yeah we'll know ifyou guys have 4000 AT-11s, just like those F-16s and F-22s and AWACS etc.

4. Read this site:

http://armor.kiev.ua...RM/refleks.html

Even the Ukraine Army is using it only for elite regiments because of the high cost. But it is easy to see why Pak will use the same missile to quadruple their inventory

link you just gave is 2-3 years old...read the copyright notice


again man..try to understand we cant show off numbers koz then other countries wont shows us dollars...thanx to our corrupt political leaders (

[Einsteinuddin]

1. SIPRI says that the deal itself is inconclusive/unknown.

2. Jane's is dated May 2002.

3. Yeah we'll know ifyou guys have 4000 AT-11s, just like those F-16s and F-22s and AWACS etc.

4. Read this site:

http://armor.kiev.ua...RM/refleks.html

Even the Ukraine Army is using it only for elite regiments because of the high cost. But it is easy to see why Pak will use the same missile to quadruple their inventory

link you just gave is 2-3 years old...read the copyright notice


again man..try to understand we cant show off numbers koz then other countries wont shows us dollars...thanx to our corrupt political leaders (

Phrozen,

People like you can't READ!

I said that Jane's info is May 2002.

The link I gave was to illustrate that AT-11s are so expensive even for Ukraine's army then how can Pak buy them to make their inventory 5 times the size!

Next time pick up some reading comprehension skills

[instantexcess]

The link I gave was to illustrate that AT-11s are so expensive even for Ukraine's army then how can Pak buy them to make their inventory 5 times the size!

well's ukraine's army isnt the 5th largest armoured Army on the planet .... B)

and its like saying that Egypt cannont have 80 K-8s cuz Pakistan and China combined dont have that much !



anyways the sale from Belarus and not ukraine !

plus the #. in one army has nothing to with the # in the other army!

[Einsteinuddin]

So if Pak has bought a new missile to increase their inventory by 5 times, why is it not mentioned in Jane's?

This is just one more on the list of wet dreams - F-22s, JSF, Awacs etc...

I'm pretty sure Pak got a few AT-11s along with the T-80s from Ukraine but 3,800 is BS!

[instantexcess]

yep .... keep denying it .... not that ur whininy little ass matters anyways !

[Einsteinuddin]

yep .... keep denying it .... not that ur whininy little ass matters anyways !

And you keep dreaming about it. Not that it matters

BTW, why did you delete the Kargil thread yesterday?

[Kelsier]

nope ameer....army is gonna procure it and they placed the order!

prove your tall claims...

Edited by Ameer Kiani, 19 November 2002 - 05:51 PM.

[lifeisfun]

"As of mid-2000 India planned to acquire T-90 tanks, based on field trials which had already been completed. Although orders had been placed for the supply of 124 Arjun tanks through the Defence Research Development Organisation, it would be difficult to predict when these orders would be fufilled. Until such time, T-90 tanks would serve to counter Pakistan's T-85 tanks. "

http://www.globalsec...india/arjun.htm


"The first 120 tanks to be built would cost $4.2 million each, while other cost estimates places the figure at $5.6 million each per tank by 2001, given a purchase of 124 tanks to equip two regiments. Production of the first batch of tanks might take more than the planned five years, given the capacity at the Avadi factory."

[ssbinz]

will india be poducing every single part of t-90 or will it depend on russia for engines etc.......